2G to 3G HO implementation by operators

[kema2103]

2G to 3G HO in areas where 3G Coverage is good and 2G is poor.

does somebody know if there are operators in Europe or the world that have implemented these handovers from 2G to 3G in circuit switched. Do you have experience from other projects and maybe know operators that are using 2G – 3G handovers in Voice?

thanks and regards.

[Md.Moniruzzaman]

No there is no operator for 2G to 3G Handover support.
Basically technology architecture doesn't support it.
In order to handover from different RAT user equipment has to measure both in a single RAT architecture frame.
3G-2G it possible due to compressed mode.
There is no compress mode or like this idea in 2G.
But re-selection possible in both way 2G-3G /3G-2G.

[scorpion]

There are some technical challenges like the ones...

1.BSC ability to send RANAP-HO Request message
2.BSC to understand UMTS ciphering..

[boring]

actually technology supports 2g-to-3g cs handovers. you have to configure 3g with 2g neighbouring list together with a few parameters

years ago i was working for a mobile operator in europe who had activated this feature which works fine

however in general it is not used because 3g sites are co-sited with 2g site, so by default 2g coverage is always better than 3g. so operators de-activate this feature and always allow a 2g call to terminate on to 2g and only through idle-mode procedures to return to 3g coverage

[jimjim]

Dears,

We are preparing to launch a 3G network in addition to existing 2G network. What do you think is the best and optimum handover strategy to be applied in the begining of this launch?

@boring would you kindly tell more about your experience with the European operator, what was the core vendor? Were there any modifications that took place from the core side? Who is the UTRAN vendor?

Any information is highly appreciated.

:)
Regards,

[mohyedeen_alkousy]

2G to 3G HO in areas where 3G Coverage is good and 2G is poor.

does somebody know if there are operators in Europe or the world that have implemented these handovers from 2G to 3G in circuit switched. Do you have experience from other projects and maybe know operators that are using 2G – 3G handovers in Voice?

thanks and regards.

Hi Kema2103
attached file is NSN experience regarding GSM to WCDMA interworking , it explain every thing including cell reselection and ISHO


pass of file: lailahilaalah (http://www.finetopix.com/reputation.php?do=addreputation&p=133849)

[diman]

actually technology supports 2g-to-3g cs handovers. you have to configure 3g with 2g neighbouring list together with a few parameters

years ago i was working for a mobile operator in europe who had activated this feature which works fine

however in general it is not used because 3g sites are co-sited with 2g site, so by default 2g coverage is always better than 3g. so operators de-activate this feature and always allow a 2g call to terminate on to 2g and only through idle-mode procedures to return to 3g coverage

But I think it could be used for sites which are having high blocking in 2G while low utilize in 3G. In our trial by configuring some parameters it can slightly increase the CS traffic in 3G and decrease blocking in 2G.

Anybody want to share the best method or parameter for Inter System Handover (ISHO) 2G - 3G in CS mode ? :handshake

[s52d]

But I think it could be used for sites which are having high blocking in 2G while low utilize in 3G. In our trial by configuring some parameters it can slightly increase the CS traffic in 3G and decrease blocking in 2G.

Anybody want to share the best method or parameter for Inter System Handover (ISHO) 2G - 3G in CS mode ? :handshake

Hi!

Most networks do not use it: there is a reason why someone is on 2G, and
keep it there for another minute or two to end voice call, then it might use
idle mode cell reselection to 3G.

We started using 2g to 3g active mode handovers when 3G coverage become usable.
Using MSC counters we tuned parameters to keep ping-pong on acceptable level.
H/O is started only if 3G cell has good RSCP as well as EcNo, and we start pushing
voice to 3G when 2G cell is loaded.
Consequence: slightly higher drop rate on 3G (remember, there is a reason why someone is on 2G), slightly higher CS voice traffic on 3G. We are happy, as it helps
lower HR usage and congestion on 2G.

BR
s52d

[jimjim]

Hi Kema2103
attached file is NSN experience regarding GSM to WCDMA interworking , it explain every thing including cell reselection and ISHO


pass of file: lailahilaalah (http://www.finetopix.com/reputation.php?do=addreputation&p=133849)


Hello Moyhedeen,

Would you kindly tell who is your RAN provider?

:)
Regards,

[kema2103]

Thanks I appreciate your help on this topic.


Hi Kema2103
attached file is NSN experience regarding GSM to WCDMA interworking , it explain every thing including cell reselection and ISHO


pass of file: lailahilaalah (http://www.finetopix.com/reputation.php?do=addreputation&p=133849)

[pranayrf]

Hi Kema2103
attached file is NSN experience regarding GSM to WCDMA interworking , it explain every thing including cell reselection and ISHO


pass of file: lailahilaalah (http://www.finetopix.com/reputation.php?do=addreputation&p=133849)


Hi,
I am unable to open the attached document.I need help in 2g-3g handover for NSN vendor.

[Egorka]

Depends on the overal traffic handling strategy.
In some networks may become a hot topic depending on spectrum availabilit, which maybe subject to regulations, refarming and such.
Example: GSM spectrum was reduced by the Regulator + Refarming. As the result the strategy was changed to "shift as much as possible traffic to 3G" and the 2G-3G HO test is ongoing.

[kema2103]

Thanks, yes it seems that is very rare that some operator prefers to go and use from 3G to 2G direction.

[s52d]

Thanks, yes it seems that is very rare that some operator prefers to go and use from 3G to 2G direction.

We all do 3g to 2g. Coverage ....
BSS to UTRAN is rare.

BR

[kema2103]

Yes indeed, I swapped here directions :-) so it should be 2G -> 3G

[boring]

Dears,

We are preparing to launch a 3G network in addition to existing 2G network. What do you think is the best and optimum handover strategy to be applied in the begining of this launch?

@boring would you kindly tell more about your experience with the European operator, what was the core vendor? Were there any modifications that took place from the core side? Who is the UTRAN vendor?

Any information is highly appreciated.

:)
Regards,

sorry for the delayed response...

well UTRAN & core vendor was E*******. and no modifications took place at the core side

the only configuration that we did was to populate with 3G neighbours, the 2G neighbouring lists.

br

[jimjim]

sorry for the delayed response...

well UTRAN & core vendor was E*******. and no modifications took place at the core side

the only configuration that we did was to populate with 3G neighbours, the 2G neighbouring lists.

br

Hello there,

I do not think just defining 2g neighbors in 3g sites will allow a mobile to handover. Your 2G sites vendor should provide a feature on his sites to allow intercation with 3G.

Our 2G site provider will install a new feature to allow 2g sites to interact with 3g technology.

In a previous replies on this thread, some said that "we tuned some parameters from the core side, to keep ping pong at an acceptable level", which means that you need to modify something from the core side.

:)
Regards,

[jimjim]

Hi!

Most networks do not use it: there is a reason why someone is on 2G, and
keep it there for another minute or two to end voice call, then it might use
idle mode cell reselection to 3G.

We started using 2g to 3g active mode handovers when 3G coverage become usable.
Using MSC counters we tuned parameters to keep ping-pong on acceptable level.
H/O is started only if 3G cell has good RSCP as well as EcNo, and we start pushing
voice to 3G when 2G cell is loaded.
Consequence: slightly higher drop rate on 3G (remember, there is a reason why someone is on 2G), slightly higher CS voice traffic on 3G. We are happy, as it helps
lower HR usage and congestion on 2G.

BR
s52d

Dear s52d,

Would you kindly tell who is your RAN and CS provider?

:)
Regards,

[boring]

Hello there,

I do not think just defining 2g neighbors in 3g sites will allow a mobile to handover. Your 2G sites vendor should provide a feature on his sites to allow intercation with 3G.

Our 2G site provider will install a new feature to allow 2g sites to interact with 3g technology.

In a previous replies on this thread, some said that "we tuned some parameters from the core side, to keep ping pong at an acceptable level", which means that you need to modify something from the core side.

:)
Regards,

hi

i don't believe (and in fact i don't know any CN features) controlling intersystem handovers. actually, i read the e-mail you said which states merely that "Using MSC counters we tuned parameters to keep ping-pong on acceptable level." meaning that they simply used counters to fine tune parameters (which are at the radio side)

depending on the GERAN vendor you have a bunch of parameters controlling when a 2G->3G handover should take place (e.g. only if 2G load is very high, or whenever 3G coverage is sufficiantly good e.g. minimum EcNo). but like i said the major step needed for these handovers is configuration of 3G neighbours and also an important parameter is the one controlling the maximum number of 3G neighbours (values 1 to 3) which could occupy one of the six reporting positions.

(of course GERAN vendor must support this feature :p)

[s52d]

Dear s52d,

Would you kindly tell who is your RAN and CS provider?

:)
Regards,

E///. Of course, some features might be needed.
Also, all definitions must be correct (we use cna_import to define utran cells).

BR
s52d